So I worked from home yesterday and text my wife "I'm dressed I've gone for a casual look today" to which she text back "Ok see you lunch time.. Can't wait to see how you look"
Wish I'd taken a photo now but from 'Tinternet this is the sort of look I mean with Blue Jeggins, Brown ankle boots and a long sleeve button up blouse with a collar, toned down makeup (less bright lippy) and my brunette with blonde streaks wig.. Satisfied i looked ok for whatever reason nervous about my wife seeing me as "Casual Davina" ... My reason for trying this I suppose was just exploring "if" I went out en-fem as Davina how would I dress.. so that's the sort of look i went for and was happy with it too..
She came home and her first words were "Wow I like that look you look far more convincing as a woman more in line with dressing your age or as women of your age dress that's the most convincing I've seen you look"
Wow morale booster and a half.
We chatted for a bit about lack of similar blouses with sleeves and buttoned up and again she said that was my new look and I looked really good..
So off back to work she trotted and she text me " Definitely a better look much more passable lol" to which I quipped and planted a seed "Thankyou my new look then, ready to go out then lol"
This must have played on her mind a little and after she read a few of the forum articles in here when we were in bed she started chatting about the forum and the people on the forum and we got round to some more fears which surfaced..
- The main fear remains we dont anyone locally, friends or family to know I'm a crossdresser because peaple assume and assume makes an ass of u and me ..
- I've kinda moved the goal posts bit in mentioning wanting to go out.. Why do i want to go out? a whole new post. It's just something I'd like to experience (I will put a new post on this).
This is still in the balance as I know she doesn't really want to do it but understands i'd like this experience so if I want to do it she will help accommodate it - I likewise don't want her to do what shes not 100% comfortable about hence trying to look passable as would have to fool general public if we do go out.
- I've kinda moved the goalpost from dresses and heels to every day wear which only follows the above (If we do go out I have to look convincing) - Kinda scares her that I'm trying more and more to look more and more convincing as "Davina" but reasons for this for me it's fun, it's a challenge and if we do go out I need to look the part.
- Her complimenting me on how i looked making me more confident as "Davina" she is worried it will mean I want to dress more and if we go out its something I want to do more and more to the point "Davina" will take over and Male me will be scarce.
I'm a man a father a husband and crossdressing for me is and will always be an occasional thing brought on by urges to dress which i don't expect to accelerate and don't want to do more -
Nothing to fear don't want to live as a woman or be a woman just enjoy crossdressing.
The morale boost it gives me makes me happier doesn't make me want to dress more (ie I've not dressed today and could have admittedly after our chat part of the reason i didn't dress today was our chat last night).. Also on TVChix making the top Babes chart another Morale boost and I know she's worried that someone will recognise me there which is slim to no chance
Shes also worried I'd "Try things" if I went out and she found it hard to put this into words me asking what you mean sex ? I can put this all to bed as no i'm not looking for sex as Davina (Other than with my wife if willing) She said I know you're not Gay.. Not sure how i can reassure this any more than i have.
We discussed if we went out in London around Wembley and how we'd act and she brought up shes not a lesbian to which i said i think we'd have to pretend to be two women and friends not lesbians ie unlike we usually do we wouldn't walk holding hands and we'd have to treat eachother and act like we're friends not husband and wife.. She thinks she would find this difficult (I think we'd giggle all night maybe I'm not taking this serious enough lol)
I's good that we can talk about these things (we need to continue this chat) and it's important that as a couple with her accepting my crossdressing that we do talk about these things to assure both are happy with where we are and even better I know she can read this here and comment back without having to talk just type which sometimes is far easier plus we get the point of view of others.
Its an ongoing journey of assurance for me wanting to assure my wife her fears are unfounded .. I still dress as its fun, i like doing it, its relaxing, i do feel sexy, i do get turned on (sometimes), love how it feels, love womens clothing (especially lingerie stockings , tights heels) enjoy the challenge of trying to look convincing and it's just part of me that important unimportant thing i do.
Hi Krissy
Ref ever going out I agree take it a step at a time
At the moment it’s still a “Yes would like to try it” and a “Why? No idea just seems like something I’d like to try”
It’s something we need to discuss more ie going to a trans friendly/trans-event fmaybe something Esme doesn’t want to do or feel comfortable doing and I may be the same into the unknown into the Trans scene.
Venturing out to a "mainstream" in public somewhere secluded may be more of what I’m thinking more than in public where there are lots of people where I’d have to put on an act and so would Esme.
I agree all the fears/questions that we have talking about this could be addressed in a much more benign atmosphere.
The idea people have put about Blackpool and Scarlets hotel sounds a good idea but then got to make an excuse to be there book it go have someone to look after the kids etc make an excuse why we’re not taking them blah blah blah..
I have no intention of going to the actual NFL match as “Davina” the idea would be we go up on the Friday and go out on the Friday night.. Wembley gets busy on the Saturday and then the Sunday of the match.. We know the area quite well and basing it on we’ve never bumped into anyone we know when up there in the last few years we will discuss this more in the coming weeks and months as NFL isn’t there until October.
Good comparisons Katie
“With crossdressers it's the need to dress better, have better makeup etc. Trying different styles is just an experiment” - Its a challenge
“To an extent going out is a way of validating all the hard work that you have put in to your 'hobby'” - Not sure this is why I want to go out and I don’t want to show it off to the public.
We see it from a different angle (can't see the harm) – Exactly its that important unimportant thing a bit of fun nothing to worry about .. we know its nothing to worry about but nevertheless our wives are programmed to worry.
Sindy xxxx
“Head on out the door in your jeggings, Davina, lol. All the same questions would run through my head…
why – Don’t really know lol may be fun bit boring just dressing indoors
with who – with Esme
This casual look was a good idea as Esme said I looked good but not necessarily to go out just thought if we do ever go out its a look I have to master and looked ok.
Dressing up isn’t the wrong gender I’m a man however I dress lol
Having “Davina” look like a sister or friend I think is rather unsettling for Esme as we discussed how we’d have to behave if we were hypothetically out we’d have to act like two female friends and I think Esme felt this weird lol I understand why.
What am I trying to achieve with all this – No idea just having fun with it and trying to improve how I look which is part of the fun. There is no fun aside as its not that serious its fun and relaxing oh and fun.. I know Sindy “How can wearing a bra be fun?” well to us it is lol.
WE fret over not wanting to upset our spouse thats not fun at all and believe it or not we worry about this a lot even with acceptance.
WHY do you want to look more realistic? - Because we like the challenge
Why would you like your wife to see the image of you as realistic female – because I would rather her see me as a passable female when we have a girls night in, or when I work from home than a drag queen? Because she’s asked me to look classy not trashy?
If it’s destroying her image of me as Alpha man then that’s a bit sad as I’m Alpha man at least 350 days of the year.
What do the general public and society at large provide you if you go out publically dressed? - If you pass I would think it feels an accomplishment.. to have fooled people into thinking you’re a woman.. don’t really know.. perhaps tgirls who have been out can answer this.
Are you not just pushing goal posts because they're there to push? Maybe as I don’t really know why I’d like to try going out.
Or is there more to it, and you're just in denial? Big NO to this I’min full control of my crossdressing and that’s all it is noting more.
Coming from the actual male side of it all, it is so bloody difficult to understand too but I do get the damn sport metaphors and goal posts lol.
The further and further apart the goal posts the easier it is to score a goal.
"isn't it time to quit this game already? Not at the moment one day maybe if it isn’t a fun thing.
Aren't you tired of it?' Not at the moment no.
It doesn’t have to be exhausting just need to talk about it and the more you talk the easier it is to remove angst and understand.
I don’t think psychologists all understand crossdressing I’ve read so many psyc notes and posts on the internt and thought “nope that’s not me”
Most people have sexual fantasies (yep) and even kinks, but that MOST men consider these proclivities a NEED, while most women can do without… man hat on “Why do women do without?” is it a rule or something we don’t know about like all of a sudden wearing flat shoes andt rousers lol (sorry)
Crossdressing is an URGE.
“In fact, men are so incapable of living without their base desires that they're entirely awful to live with if they don't meet these needs. Sound like anyone we know?”
Now then here’s something .. we hide away most of our emotions but we wear passion on our sleeves in sport and in life. Base desires are always there so why do women suppress theirs?
Men make sacrifices too and men sacrifice themselves for the kids too its a shared responsibility bringing.
So how do you make sense of Davina's need to do these things? - Happy for Esme to set boundaries, chatting to her now watching this Trans program on TV which is waaaaay over to the right of the Trans spectrum I really feel sorry for some of these “women” and how they’ve had to suppress their feelings that they are women and I get it when we’re looked down upon as “playing Trans” being part time tgirls / crossdressers and thats all we are and all we ever intend being/
If he can't keep this in check (I reckon he can – You know me well Sindy)
If theoretically I can’t (but I can) Esmes own personal well being needs to come into focus and she can tell me off for going too far or move our acceptance level back down whatever.
We tgirls spend and inordinate time worrying about how our crossdressing makes our wives feel.
Great post Sindy keep it up xx
Davina
Cool you’ve helped develop you “other half” Emma..Whats his her name and why won’t you let her on here? My wifes helped me too “Classy not Trashy” and we’ve discussed a shared wardrobe which we need to sort out.
Dressing down so to speak was ok .. Katie ribbing me about a past comment won’t catch me ever in jeggings lol
The idea is to try to pass and look as good as I can.. part of the fun not necessarily to fool people just for my own satisfaction.
Esme does need to pull her finger out and add her thoughts you’re right Emma lol
Davina
I would just like to re-iterate my point from the other thread - I really think you should take it a step at a time - go to a trans friendly/trans-event first before venturing out to a "mainstream" event. All of these fears/questions that you & Esme have articulated can be addressed in a much more benign atmosphere than worrying about how you might feel awkward/embarrassed/trapped/stranded out in public like you might at an NFL game...
Pleasure. For all the effort we put into looking like women, we'll never think like women. We try our best to understand but sometimes we can't comprehend your responses either. Two different species at times!
Thanks for the reply, Katie. As always you help me comprehend the incomprehensible!
I don't think that I have an end goal with crossdressing. There is no end result where I can say 'Done what I set out to do now I can quit'. I think that's the same with most 'hobbies' - you just keep going, getting bigger and better toys. Maybe one day it will all stop but I think it is to ingrained. Men tend to have 'hobbies' that can envelop their lives. I have a friend who keeps tropical marine fish. He'll spend thousands on pounds setting up a new aquarium. Spend hours making sure the water condition and lighting are perfect for all the corals to grow. Then he'll get bored and sell everything (purge). Six months later he'll do it all again. There's always some 'new, better kit' which we feel the need to own. I think it's a male thing. With crossdressers it's the need to dress better, have better makeup etc. Trying different styles is just an experiment. To an extent going out is a way of validating all the hard work that you have put in to your 'hobby'. Men have clubs and events where they can show off all the hard work they have put into their 'hobbies'. They like to show it off to the public.
Some women have 'hobbies' and do the same but most of the time they just seem to get on with life.
I know I don't and I doubt most crossdressers go out of their way to upset heir wives. We see it from a different angle (can't see the harm) so rely on you to say 'Stop doing that it make me uncomfortable'. I think in the majority of cases we'd hope to find a compromise. We can put the brakes on, I don't spend a fortune on Katie, I could but it wouldn't be right. I coudl dress more but I don't. There are things I'd liek to do as Katie but I don't.
I'm sure my friend would like to have a massive reef aquarium but he has neither the space, the money or a wife who will let him. There are limits to any 'hobby'. I know that crossdressing is more than a 'hobby' but at least it explains men's mindsets.
Katie
Wow Sindy
Look forward to Davina answering your questions and any other Tgirls
Id like to know my husbands answers to some of these too
A few of us are accepting wives but I guess we still all have fears about where this all could go
Well, obviously, I'm going to agree with all Esme's worries. Wouldn't be Sindy if I just said no biggie, head on out the door in your jeggings, Davina, lol. All the same questions would run through my head...why and with who and what and omg he's wearing jeggings... :-D
Thing is, this casual look might have been a good idea to help life outside be less confronting, but it's also turned out to be rather confronting inside the house. I know my husband can work between fantasy girl, as Katie wrote, and real girl, and I can't stand seeing either because both are the wrong gender! But I can see how having Davina look like a sister or friend is rather unsettling. There does come a point, I think, when every crossdresser needs to take a good long look at what it is they're trying to achieve with all this. Fun aside, because unless upsetting your spouse is fun then this is a moot point, what else is going on? WHY do you want to look more realistic? Why would you like your wife to see the image of you as realistic female, possibly destroying her image of you as male? What do the general public and society at large provide you if you go out publically dressed? Are you not just pushing goal posts because they're there to push?
Or is there more to it, and you're just in denial?
Coming from the actual female side of it all, it is so bloody difficult to understand all these damn sport metaphors and goal posts in the first place, let alone the constant and relentless desire to make them further and further apart. I'm just here thinking, "isn't it time to quit this game already? Aren't you tired of it?' And instead, our husbands are plotting their next outfit/outing/online experience or whatever. It makes so little sense to me and yet it's clearly the standard path for men who crossdress because y'all are here doing it, and my husband is doing it, and it's exhausting!
Esme, I don't know what the answer is, I really don't. I read something the other day that made me think of all this - a psychologist was explaining how most people have sexual fantasies and even kinks, but that MOST men consider these proclivities a NEED, while most women can do without. In fact, men are so incapable of living without their base desires that they're entirely awful to live with if they don't meet these needs. Sound like anyone we know? Women don't do this and if we can't have a need met, we just get on with it and don't think about it. I think we all know it's often mothers who sacrifice the most of themselves for their kids, and even their husbands if needed.
So how do you make sense of Davina's need to do these things? You can't. All you can do is tell him your boundaries, insist they're important for the stability of your marriage, and then let him do the rest. If he can't keep this in check (I reckon he can but theoretically if he can't) then your own personal wellbeing needs to come into focus. Look after you. Thats my motto this year, and the rest will fall as it will.
Sindy. x
Ive helped my other half progress his look and yes I've had the wobbles about how he now looks which is far more convincing than when he first dressed in front of me.
We have a shared wardrobe with things we both wear and hes more likely now to dress down than to dress up if you get what i mean less in a dress and heels more in every day things when we have a night in or when i take him out lol
It does make him more real looking and passable after all we dont wear a dress all the time skinny jeans and leggings more todays look like in the pics
I understand how you might feel Esme but its Davina he\shes ok and you guys talk about this like adults so you have nothing to worry about in his change of look in fact you may have influenced him to try this look?
Be nice to hear from you on here so we know youre doing ok 💗
Emma (Wife)
Davina, i think we have discussed before that 'blending in' is more a problem for tgirls mentally than society itself. i get where your better half is coming from because she is now seeing you taking on board advice as to how you should dress when you go to the NFl match. Now seeing you dressed in this manner has moved the switch from a talking point to a factual point. Is it a case of discsussing the fears, reiterating your beliefs that you just happen to be a hetrosexual man who likes wearing ladies clothes. Noting that this is being brought to life with the full knowledge and understanding of a fantastic lady (your wife). Maybe there is some learning to be had along this road to Wembley and your good lady's advice will be invaluable in ensuring that you a fantastic time together.
Agreed going out would be a next step and if she feels its a step too far than a house tgirl i shall remain.
Also get the point on the fantasy Tgirl look dress and heels etc but she's the one who said i need to look classy noT trashy lol
I think part of our chat yesterday was due to a step change in how I looked more real and thats why she couldnt explain how she felt ie married a man but me being more like a woman seems to have worried her.
So I thought it good to put here as something weve not seen before in the forum.
Hopefully Esme can read others thoughts too
What i SAid is its still me no matter how i look its me
It's not me you need to convince lol.
It's a matter of perception. If Esme perceives of you as more of a woman in casual gear then that bring sexuality into it whether that is your intention or not. As I said coping with 'fantasy' woman may be easier than 'real' woman if that makes sense.
She probably needs the reassurance that nothing will change. She may look at going out as a progression whuch is scary.
Katie
Two distinct parts to me man and man lol man and occasional crossdresser so no I'd not wear womens jeans out as a man or any other type of give away clothing which would identify me as possible trans.
I hate sexuality being part of this mine or hers I'm a man (As you know if it were upto me I'd remove the T from LGBTQ) so shes straight and I'm straight to me is end of sports but obviously I don't look like a man when I'm dressed so mindful of how this is hard for her and I won't push the sexual aspect with her if she's not happy with it or finds it hard to cope with..
There's no way "Davina" will be popping to the shops for milk lol
I've controlled my crossdressing urges all these years so know nothing much will change if we went out or not or however I dress when i crossdress.
I suppose, in someway, dressed down, as a real woman may dress everyday, it somehow becomes a bit more real in itself. Suddenly a whole new opportunity arises - going out in the real world and passing.
I can understand Esme's fears that once you have the taste for it, things may suddenly progress. If you feel that you can get away with it then why not just pop down to the shops for a pint of milk? That is where the fear of being found out by friends and neighbours comes in.
It will take some reassurance and boundaries not to let this become an issue.
I also think that dressing for everday become more real in the sense that it's no longer 'fantasy'. Heels, dress, sexy lingerie is all fantasy dressing which maybe easier to understand than just a jeans and a shirt. When do you blur the line between men's jeans and women's jeans? If Esme is worried about being found out then this would be an issue. Would you wear women's jeans instead of men's?
Maybe even being more passable makes you more of a woman which makes Esme uncomfortbale. As you said she is not a lesbian but her being able to see less of her husband and more of a woman may cause her concern.
Just a few thoughts.
Katie
Mad with even as established as our relationship is and Esmes Acceptance of me dressing that we still have fears and worries and still need to talk but "It's good to talk"